They make good cheap Win98/Win2k systems, that's about it. People tend to pick Pentium 2/3 or a later P4/AXP/A64 for Win98 machines so early P4s like yours often get overlooked when they're perfectly capable. It can also be used for very early XP but I would expect it's performance to cap out very quickly so you're better off building something much stronger.

For your use case, if you've got 98 well covered already by better machines, there's probably not much use for it. Maybe toss on an obscure/not as used OS on it to muck around a bit? Do you have a friend that would be interested in a retro machine for dirt cheap/free? I had a similar 'extra' 1.5ghz p4 build that I gave to a friend so he could join us for UT99/Counterstrike LANs.

gen_angry wrote on 2023-04-19, 03:43:

They make good cheap Win98/Win2k systems, that's about it. People tend to pick Pentium 2/3 or a later P4/AXP/A64 for Win98 machines so early P4s like yours often get overlooked when they're perfectly capable. It can also be used for very early XP but I would expect it's performance to cap out very quickly so you're better off building something much stronger.

For your use case, if you've got 98 well covered already by better machines, there's probably not much use for it. Maybe toss on an obscure/not as used OS on it to muck around a bit? Do you have a friend that would be interested in a retro machine for dirt cheap/free? I had a similar 'extra' 1.5ghz p4 build that I gave to a friend so he could join us for UT99/Counterstrike LANs.

Yeah I've already got 3 XP systems for early, mid, and late XP eras, with mostly period correct hardware, so there's no use case for that. Maybe I'll just run 2000 on it and call it good. I bought it for $5 so basically nothing, and it's complete so why not? Nobody else I know is into older PC hardware, and I always catch grief for living in the past, 🤣.

I really like the Socket 423 Pentium 4s for a few reasons:

- Pretty rare
- RD RAM (also rare)
- Mostly before capacitor plague
- Interesting (in that they are slow haha)
- No HT so I don't feel bad running Win9x/2000 on them
- Probably increase in price due to being rare

In terms of usefulness, not really. A 478 P4 is much more upgradeable and useful.

I have 2-3 423 machines 😁

And there is at least one super cool Socket 423 motherboard called the ASUS P4T that will tell you in a robotic voice through the headphone output what the POST error is 😁

I also have a Dimension 8100. I also have its 478 successor, the Dimension 8200. And yes, the 8200 has leaking caps but the 8100 does not.

martin778 wrote on 2023-04-19, 10:37:

And there is at least one super cool Socket 423 motherboard called the ASUS P4T that will tell you in a robotic voice through the headphone output what the POST error is 😁

That reminds me of this particular brand of old pre-Pentium PCs I used to work on that would speak (using pre-recorded digitized voice) some BIOS errors through the PC speaker. I can still hear that female voice saying "check your keyboard connection".

Mine was only PTSD-inducing, it would repeat "System failed CPU test" 😁

@Errius,
I think it's also very application specific, I have a 2006 XPS600 that that a few bulging caps and you know what - these caps run warm to touch, even after replacement with the same rating. I'd say it's sometimes a design failure (or failure by design).

Brawndo wrote on 2023-04-19, 03:37:

Let me start off by saying that I currently have PLENTY of old PCs already, more than enough Win9x and XP systems, but I have some systems laying around not being used and I'm wondering if they're worth keeping and using for any reason. I have a couple socket 423 systems that I am not currently using, and wondering if there's any benefit to using those for retro gaming when I already have P2, P3, and Athlon systems set up using various configurations of video and sound cards. One of them is a Dell Dimension 8100 and it's a beast of a tower, quite heavy duty, currently has a P4 1.5 GHz and 512 MB RDRAM with a GeForce2 MX. If I do anything with it, I would likely run Win2000 just for the heck of it as I have Win98 more than covered.

What do you all think of the socket 423 for gaming purposes?

I think it's mostly for novelty. It's a fairly rare platform with some fairly obscure options (RDRAM and a very uncommon way of mounting CPU HSFs) and performancewise it should have roughly a similar performance spread as Coppermine+Tualatin, but without the same AGP compatibility, but also without relying heavily on 5v either (though P3 also isn't too heavy on 5v anyway).

Especially if you already build a lot of retro rigs from this era, building a s423 may be fun if only because hardware wise it's a bit different from Slot, s370/sA or PGA478 of which plenty exists.

IIRC 423 had standard PC133 SDRAM support as well, not just RDRAM. I have a SDRAM based 423 mobo w/ 1.5GHz Willy, and it's pretty interesting.

Probably bragging rights for having something rare. Socket 423 was only manufactured for a year or so before being replaced with Socket 478. They also need special PSU because of it's AT style auxiliary power connector. Most of the times they also require RDRAM for which you needed a C-RIMM module for the slots for which you don't have RAM for. Socket 423 is not really good for a practical build. Socket 423 has nothing that makes it better than early Sokcet 478 for the same purposes.

gen_angry wrote on 2023-04-19, 03:43:

They make good cheap Win98/Win2k systems, that's about it.

Nope. Because of their rarity, it's not easy to pick them up for cheap.

What do you all think of the socket 423 for gaming purposes?

SDRAM - worthless.
RDRAM - pricy and worthless.

If you just want "RDRAM" feel, there's plenty of S478 options, which are better.

I find it a fantastic platform for Windows 98 and 2000.

I own both the Asus P4T and the Abit TH7, both are great motherboards. I also own a very plain DFI board and I probably still have an Intel D850GB somewhere as well.

I have not had any issues with bad caps on any of these boards.

A few years ago someone in EU (Germany?) sold loads of Intel D850GB new in box for ~15 euro each or something like that. I kind of regret not buying a few. 😁

Honestly, the MSI 845 Pro I have w/ SDR doesn't feel slow. That, and Northwood support 😁 (though no HT, AFAIK)

PcBytes wrote on 2023-04-19, 11:25:

IIRC 423 had standard PC133 SDRAM support as well, not just RDRAM. I have a SDRAM based 423 mobo w/ 1.5GHz Willy, and it's pretty interesting.

I have an ABIT BW7 board like that. It doesn't work though. I think the previous owner damaged it with overclocking.

I'd check the caps. Most of these came at a point where even good brands had issues - look at most of the 2001-2005 Nichicon HM and HN batches.

I've also seen some HDs go bad, though not so much.

Even my BE6-II got polymodded - originally had Tayeh that I wouldn't have entrusted in as much as a phone charger. Used some caps from a 775 mobo that died (some MOSFET killed itself after a long time.) and it's been running sweet since then. Also fixed the clearance issue between my P3 650's heatsink sled-style bracket and the caps.

I have a little collection of s423 motherboards, mostly QDI brand. Why? Because they have PC/PCI connectors on them meaning they support DOS sound even without ISA slots.

Socket 423 was limited to Willamette P4 with 180 nm lithography, the same as Coppermine P3; even Tualatin P3 had the newer 130 nm lithography. If Tualatin P3 is too rare and costly for you, then Socket 478 Northwood (130 nm) and Prescott (90 nm) P4 were cheap and plenty, plus you could still find Athlon 64 in Socket 754 or 939 with corresponding lithography and better energy efficiency then NetBurst. Not to mention that functional DDR modules are far easier to find than RDRAM.

So, for collection value, sure; for praticality value, nah.

mwdmeyer wrote on 2023-04-19, 04:20:

I really like the Socket 423 Pentium 4s for a few reasons: […]
Show full quote

I really like the Socket 423 Pentium 4s for a few reasons:

- Pretty rare
- RD RAM (also rare)
- Mostly before capacitor plague
- Interesting (in that they are slow haha)
- No HT so I don't feel bad running Win9x/2000 on them
- Probably increase in price due to being rare

In terms of usefulness, not really. A 478 P4 is much more upgradeable and useful.

I have 2-3 423 machines 😁

All the same.
I specifically built one for these reasons.

I like to collect top performance parts as much as collecting unusual/weird things.

- I like triple core CPUs
- GPUs not made by the usual suspects (Kyro, Matrox, SiS/XGI)
- Raptor Hard drives
- SLI / Crossfire setups
- Multi GPU cards
- MicroDrives
- EAX/A3D positional audio
- I-Ram
- Physx cards

All these things were cutting edge tech at some point... And disappeared later. And I think they worth being preserved.

About the usefulness of a s423 system, yes, you can definitely do the same things with an Athlon, a P3 or a later P4. But this definitely worth it for curiosity.

Mostly good for the lolz, as it's a prime example of everything wrong with the early P4. It's a relatively rare platform, so the most practical use of it is selling it to collectors if you don't want it. But some s423 boards have a PC/PCI header or a spot to solder one, and that would be great for DOS compatibility with sound cards that can use the header.