Slube looks to have been using a different game version to me, so I've been experimenting with his packs. Now, via the equiv system I'm seeing all sorts of things I hadn't before, like blood, smoke and the compass.

I also have the letters mapped through all the levels. I'd really like to get in contact with him to check if its ok to release this updated version.

If I understand correctly, you're waiting for me to respond? By all means, release it. I don't develop texture packs, but I'd like to see everyone else's work with my version.

Can you use the equiv file with audio packs?

slube wrote:

If I understand correctly, you're waiting for me to respond? By all means, release it. I don't develop texture packs, but I'd like to see everyone else's work with my version.

Sorry Slube. I am being particularly dim today. I mean Quest.

noname wrote:

Can you use the equiv file with audio packs?

Ooo! Er! Yes, I think it will. It is all C++ classes and rubbish like that, and all those texture triggered things are derived off the same base class. Should just work.

I'm still coming late to the Equivalence file party. What exactly is this particular file and how is it useful?

I would like to get to a point where we have:

1) One equivalence file that everyone can use 'as-is' and sorts out the multiple versions of the game issues
2) For this 'master' file to be cleaned of all duplicates
3) For there to be a 'best practice' tutorial on how to use this equivalence file and how to use it in conjunction with mappings to other better named folders

Are we anywhere near there yet? Sorry, but I've been away from this issue for some time and don't really understand what progress has been made because there are snippets of info spread over lots of threads.

Glidos wrote:

Ooo! Er! Yes, I think it will. It is all C++ classes and rubbish like that, and all those texture triggered things are derived off the same base class. Should just work.

Are you seriously? When you make that thing to work?

Antonijadis wrote:

Are you seriously? When you make that thing to work?

Should jusrt work. Just put a mapping file or equiv file in the Audio folder and it should be used.

Hi Gambit,

We have No. 1, but maybe not in the form you are thinking. We have a single equiv file that just handles the different game versions, but doesn't consolidate the textures repeated between levels. This allows someone to develop a pack using one version of the game, and then at a last stage they can update their pack to work on either version. They do this either by combining the levels equiv file with their own (using the tool), or - if they did not use an equiv file, they can just include the levels equiv file as it stands.

I'm confused by 2 because equiv files contain only duplicates.

3. I don't believe I know how best to use them. One approach is to capture the whole game (with the version of the game you are working with), and use the tool to generate one massive equiv file. Using that will guarantee that each texture you create gets automatically repeated in all places in the game where it appears. But you may find that you don't always want that. You may find that you want to delete lines from the equiv file so that you can make a single texture appear differently in different levels. JC does this to get rid of the M in the Coloseum while still having the work MIDAS in the Midas level. The details will probably differe from author to author.

OK, understand better now!

As for 2, I didn't make myself clear: I mean what would be useful is a way of actually deleting the duplicate files in all the folders and leaving only one file in one location. There are issues with Glidos loading multiple copies of the texture and running out of graphics memory if you don't do this. I have a great program called Duplicate File Finder which worked really well at removing all the duplicates from the extracted Legend textures (and saving 2GB! -- that's one terribly inefficient game!).

Once all the duplicates are removed, one would then create a TLNK file in place of the image that points to the better named set of folders (assuming the designer doesn't want to leave any images in any off the odd named folders).

Doing this and using the equivalence file would then "just work" - right?

If this is a good approach to take (notwithstanding issues with making specific changes, such as the Midas M), then if I were to do this and create the full folder structure for the entire game along with the equiv file, this could all be packed up as a zip and offered as a usable system for everyone. Of course, even better would be to have it include the other game variations -- is this where the file you posted comes in handy?

Ah right, I get you now. There is no facility for automatically deleting stuff, but the tool has provision for telling you if you have multiple versions of things. I think its the last item on the dialog box: you can give it a texture pack, and it will generate an equiv file, but the equiv file isn't intended for use in a pack. It reports doubled up entries. A perfect pack will yield an empty equiv file.

On creating a single folder structure and mapping file: yeah you could; but for each texture that authors need to create, you should probably include the captured texture, so that the author has a clear idea of what they are replacing. The version equiv file would handle the multiple versions of the t game, as you say. And you'd be able to use an include an equiv file to get automatic placement of textures shared between levels.

Glidos wrote:

Ah right, I get you now. There is no facility for automatically deleting stuff, but the tool has provision for telling you if you have multiple versions of things. I think its the last item on the dialog box: you can give it a texture pack, and it will generate an equiv file, but the equiv file isn't intended for use in a pack. It reports doubled up entries. A perfect pack will yield an empty equiv file.

O, got that now.

Glidos wrote:

On creating a single folder structure and mapping file: yeah you could; but for each texture that authors need to create, you should probably include the captured texture, so that the author has a clear idea of what they are replacing. The version equiv file would handle the multiple versions of the t game, as you say. And you'd be able to use an include an equiv file to get automatic placement of textures shared between levels.

Yup, that's what I meant, it would include the captured bitmaps too (though I guess this is naughty offering them for download....).

So what is the file you posted at the top of this thread? Is it the combined equiv file from both versions of the game?

Another quick question: If I have a mapping file set-up to map odd named folders to nice named folders, and I'm using an equiv file, how does Glidos search for the texture? I know it doesn't affect what I'm doing, I'm just curious!

The version equivalence file isn't exactly a combined equiv file for both versions. Its the minimum equivalence that connects the two versions, so it connects a door (say) in level 1 of the original game version with that same door in level1 of the UB version. It doesn't connect occurences between different levels.

The version equivalence file is pretty useless on its own. The idea is that an author has their own equiv file that works perfectly for their pack on their version of the game. For example, JC's equiv file maps textures between levels, but doesn't confuse the M texture. Just before release, and author can use the tool to combine their equiv file with the version file, and the result will work with any version of the game, but still things like the M texture will still not be confused.

Another way to put it is that the version equiv file has all the inter version equivalences but none of the infra version equivalences.

When a game asks Glidos for a texture, it first works out the simple file name for it... you know

A8F67CD8D\(64--128)(292--256)

that sort of thing. It then looks to see if it can find that file or something mapped to it by the mapping system.

When there's an equiv file, it also looks for other simple file names that are equivalent.

This is a note for JC:

How on earth have you managed duplicates!?!?!?!

OK, here's the deal: In your recent release of Qualopec, Folly, Colloseum and Midas, there are copies of TLNK files in each levels folders that point to the same texture -- the passport for example.

However, you've obviously deleted duplicate BMPs and TXT files from other folders so that duplicates are avoided -- this is the method I had thought was now recommended.

Duplicate pointers to the same texture really slow down the loading of textures at level start and consume extra memory.

So why do you have duplicates of some TLNK files and not others? Is it simply a mistake?

On a related note, how do you decide which folders to have the TLNK files in and which ones to delete them from (for duplicates). It seems a bit haphazard and arbitrary!

I'm not at home right now so I am going from memory here - (not always reliable with me!)
Qualopec was done pre-equiv file, and the textures for that were not included in the folder that I used to generate the equiv file. That level is working independently of the others! There should be no duplicates in the Folly through Midas levels which are running with the equiv file. Those levels do reference textures in the 'common' folder which came with the Qualopec pack, but as I said they are working independently from the Qualopec links and so are not duplicates. As I said elsewhere, I've been working on amalgamating everything - so all of the above has been ironed out in the pack I am working with now (apart from some little peculiarities which I am investigating).

how do you decide which folders to have the TLNK files in

I could have decided on a different arrangement, it doesn't really matter so long as duplicates are weeded out. I didn't have a lot of time to spare, and this was before Paul released the tool to scan for duplicates, so I pasted the equiv file into an Excel worksheet and worked through it systematically to acieve the same result. I can't remember the criteria I used for deciding which to keep, but I'm sure there was some method to my madness, even if it isn't apparent!

Yeah, that's exactly how I intended it to be used really. The only problem is that is quite a difficult procedure to follow. I wish I could make the output from duplication detection more readable; still, I'm glad you found it sufficient.

I also have the letters mapped through all the levels. I'd really like to get in contact with him to check if its ok to release this updated version.

release away ( if you haven't already done so 😀 . Been busy and 'unwired' for the last few months so I am not up on any/all the changes you have been making , it's always exciting getting back into the tech loop a few months away always seems like a few years (heh, heh)

still have a few things to lock into place but I should be reachable in a a month or so .

Great. Thanks.

Nice to see you back.

I've uploaded them here.